Nexus 8 and (no)revoshift

[blackpanther]

Hey everyone! I'm coming over from YouTube after watching that great video on Shimano Alfine/Nexus hub maintenance. I'm going to put it into practice soon (I've already done some of it).

I commented on YouTube before I saw the forum link, and I'm hoping someone here can give me their opinion on my situation.

I started with a problem of imprecise shifting in fourth and fifth gear, which I might go into more detail about in another topic.

I hate the Revoshift grip shifter that's original with Nexus 8 hubs like mine. After 15 years, it's all worn out, and I think it might be contributing to the imprecise shifting problem.

Since I have to change it, I thought I'd buy a classic trigger shifter, like the ones on mountain bikes—also 8-speed, also Shimano.

Do you think it's compatible? Okay, maybe I should have asked before I bought it, lol. But I installed it tonight, and besides the fact that the numbers on the shifter are reversed (the lightest gear shows as number 8, the heaviest as number 1), on a first ride, it doesn't shift well—it pretty much skips almost all the gears.

Could it be a problem with the adjustments? I've already done the basic one for the Nexus (lining up the yellow marker with the fourth gear engaged).

the shifter is Shimano Sl-m315, this item

Help!

 

[BikeGremlin]

Hey everyone! I'm coming over from YouTube after watching that great video on Shimano Alfine/Nexus hub maintenance. I'm going to put it into practice soon (I've already done some of it).

I commented on YouTube before I saw the forum link, and I'm hoping someone here can give me their opinion on my situation.

I started with a problem of imprecise shifting in fourth and fifth gear, which I might go into more detail about in another topic.

I hate the Revoshift grip shifter that's original with Nexus 8 hubs like mine. After 15 years, it's all worn out, and I think it might be contributing to the imprecise shifting problem.

Since I have to change it, I thought I'd buy a classic trigger shifter, like the ones on mountain bikes—also 8-speed, also Shimano.

Do you think it's compatible? Okay, maybe I should have asked before I bought it, lol. But I installed it tonight, and besides the fact that the numbers on the shifter are reversed (the lightest gear shows as number 8, the heaviest as number 1), on a first ride, it doesn't shift well—it pretty much skips almost all the gears.

Could it be a problem with the adjustments? I've already done the basic one for the Nexus (lining up the yellow marker with the fourth gear engaged).

the shifter is Shimano Sl-m315, this item

Help!

Hi,

Shimano index hubs use a different cable pull for shifting compared to external hubs and derailleurs (with cassettes).

I do not like grip shifters.

As far as I know, Shimano doesn't make any trigger shifters branded for Nexus.

Fortunately, however, based on Mićko's experience, Alfine 8s shifters can work nicely with shimano Nexus hubs (see the linked video).

Hope this helps.

Relja

 

[blackpanther]

Hi,

Shimano index hubs use a different cable pull for shifting compared to external hubs and derailleurs (with cassettes).

I do not like grip shifters.

As far as I know, Shimano doesn't make any trigger shifters branded for Nexus.

Fortunately, however, based on Mićko's experience, Alfine 8s shifters can work nicely with shimano Nexus hubs (see the linked video).

Hope this helps.

Relja

Wow, you have a video for every case! If I had found you sooner, I would have saved 50 euros literally thrown away, which I gave to an incompetent mechanic in my area.

Thanks! So I have to sell the Altus shifter again and try with the Alfine one, even if it costs a lot more money, at least buying it from Italy.

Once I've installed the shifter, I'll do some new adjustment tests. If that doesn't solve it, I'll ask for technical advice here."

 

[BikeGremlin]

Wow, you have a video for every case! If I had found you sooner, I would have saved 50 euros literally thrown away, which I gave to an incompetent mechanic in my area.

Thanks! So I have to sell the Altus shifter again and try with the Alfine one, even if it costs a lot more money, at least buying it from Italy.

Once I've installed the shifter, I'll do some new adjustment tests. If that doesn't solve it, I'll ask for technical advice here."

Sure - happy to help (even if late).

View this content on Instagram

View this content on Instagram

 

[blackpanther]

Hey everyone,

I'm finally here! My Alfine shifter arrived today, ready to replace the old Revoshift on my Nexus 8 hub.

I started to take the old cable off but had to stop everything because I don't have the right tool to cut the excess housing (or the cable itself). So, I'll have to wait until tomorrow to go buy one.

In the meantime, I was taking some measurements. I'm replacing everything, both the cable and the housing, and I got the Shimano SP41 cable, which the guide recommended. Luckily, it came with the cable already inside the housing along with the new shifter.

However, this new cable, unlike the old one (which was also Shimano but I don't know the exact model), has a metal end part that's fixed. The old cable, though, had some sort of elongated plastic piece that went into the "thingy with the yellow marks," and the new cable won't fit.

Should I just get rid of the plastic part and let the new cable's metal end go into the housing of the "thingy with the yellow marks"?

I've uploaded two photos: one of the old cable's black plastic end cap, and the other of how I've temporarily set up the new cable by removing the plastic end and just threading the new one through.

 

[BikeGremlin]

Hey everyone,

I'm finally here! My Alfine shifter arrived today, ready to replace the old Revoshift on my Nexus 8 hub.

I started to take the old cable off but had to stop everything because I don't have the right tool to cut the excess housing (or the cable itself). So, I'll have to wait until tomorrow to go buy one.

In the meantime, I was taking some measurements. I'm replacing everything, both the cable and the housing, and I got the Shimano SP41 cable, which the guide recommended. Luckily, it came with the cable already inside the housing along with the new shifter.

However, this new cable, unlike the old one (which was also Shimano but I don't know the exact model), has a metal end part that's fixed. The old cable, though, had some sort of elongated plastic piece that went into the "thingy with the yellow marks," and the new cable won't fit.

Should I just get rid of the plastic part and let the new cable's metal end go into the housing of the "thingy with the yellow marks"?

I've uploaded two photos: one of the old cable's black plastic end cap, and the other of how I've temporarily set up the new cable by removing the plastic end and just threading the new one through.

The side at the hub has those grooves to keep it fixed. You could try removing it from the old housing and mounting it on the new housing. The end at the shifter side can use a plastic cap, while for the end at the hub side it's probably best to (re)use the metal end, if possible.

Make sure to set the cable length from the end of the housing to the centre of the cable pinching nut&bolt to exactly 101 mm or 127 mm - depending on the model (see how the old model was configured to be sure).
Edit: see pages 18, and 22 of the attached PDF.

Shimano tool for measuring that - the 101 mm version (you can use a ruler, no need for this tool, but it shows what exactly is measured):

https://www.bike-discount.de/en/shimano-tl-cj40-inner-cable-fixing-bolt-setting-tool-for-gear-hub

Measuring is done when the cable is set to most slack on the shifter (not 100% sure, but it should be the first gear).

Edit - I've managed to upload a PDF manual by Shimano.

 

[blackpanther]

The shifter side is fine, it has its removable plastic cap, so if I had to do any cutting, I would cut on that side, since the other end has the metal cap that doesn't come off.

But the metal cap doesn't fit into the plastic cap of the old cable, which wasn't a standard cap but a more elongated one, which, however, seems completely normal from the manual you posted, in fact there's a drawing of how I left the bike, that is, simply inserting the metal cap of the new cable into the housing (figure 6 on page 20).

Can I leave it like that?

Basically, I don't have (and never had) the situation in figure 10 on page 24, that is, I only have the black cap from the photo I posted yesterday, which acted as the end cap for the old cable.

Oh, there's a much faster way to know the cable length and where to tighten the nut: measure! Too bad, the cable arrived with the nut already fixed, it was probably the perfect measurement but I removed it because I didn't know. I disassembled the old cable and I no longer have the reference if it was 101 or 127

Does Shimano have a tool for more than 10 euros for every little thing?

 

[BikeGremlin]

To avoid misunderstanding and confusion (for us, or anyone else reading this in the future), I'll list the parts we're discussing are with short definitions:

• Cable - steel "wire" that is pulled by the shifter and goes from the shifter to the hub.
• Housing - plastic sleeve (with steel lining) that the cable is pulled through.
• Housing ends/caps - caps that are placed at the end of the housing.

The shifter side is fine, it has its removable plastic cap, so if I had to do any cutting, I would cut on that side, since the other end has the metal cap that doesn't come off.

Yes, it makes sense to cut at the end with the (easily removable) plastic cap - that you can then put back.

The plastic cap can be replaced if it is damaged. That is a standard housing end cap. Some manufacturers make those from plastic, others make them from steel or aluminium (Shimano plastic ones are fine).

But the metal cap doesn't fit into the plastic cap of the old cable, which wasn't a standard cap but a more elongated one, which, however, seems completely normal from the manual you posted, in fact there's a drawing of how I left the bike, that is, simply inserting the metal cap of the new cable into the housing (figure 6 on page 20).

Can I leave it like that?

If you got a new cable and housing with the Alfine shifter, I would use those - keeping the fixed metal housing cap. Just check and make sure that the end cap fits snuggly - i.e. it doesn't slide further towards the hub past the part where it is placed in.

If I were reusing the old housing, and saw that a cap is damaged, then I would replace it (I'd try to find a metal end cap that fits into the stopper at the hub, instead of using plastic on that end, if possible).

Basically, I don't have (and never had) the situation in figure 10 on page 24, that is, I only have the black cap from the photo I posted yesterday, which acted as the end cap for the old cable.

Oh, there's a much faster way to know the cable length and where to tighten the nut: measure! Too bad, the cable arrived with the nut already fixed, it was probably the perfect measurement but I removed it because I didn't know. I disassembled the old cable and I no longer have the reference if it was 101 or 127

Do you have the old cable and housing intact?
If not, go with 101 mm, and see how it goes (if the cable is too tight/short, the gears won't all click).

Does Shimano have a tool for more than 10 euros for every little thing?

LOL. Yes, it is crazy.

Calipers get the job done - and so does a ruler (I like these ones that start from zero - Amazon .de affiliate link).

 

[blackpanther]

Yep, I've got the old cable and housing intact and removed from the bike, so I could use them as a guide to cut the new cable, I guess... Cutting cables and housings is always a sore point for me, I'm never very precise with it, ahah.

Anyway, the metal cap on the new cable seems to fit well and it's solid in the housing, so just by looking at it, I don't think it'll cause any problems... Also, as I was saying, the old plastic cap on the old cable, which was probably specifically designed for the housing, isn't compatible with the new metal cap because it's too small.

Luckily, I have a similar ruler, but I'm missing the cable and housing cutters, so I'll go buy today. I hope I've understood everything; I'm already spending way too much money on this bike that was supposed to have been delivered to me perfectly by the Shimano mechanic.

 

[blackpanther]

It's here at last! The cable cutter arrived, and I cut the housing and cable and installed everything.

Looking back at the instructions you posted here, it seems the original setting is with this SP41 cable, and what I've always had was adapted. That's a good thing!

The distance from the cap to the nut is 101 mm. The yellow mark in fourth gear was aligned pretty much perfectly; I just adjusted it a little with the shifter.

A quick question, though:

Should the yellow mark in fourth gear always be in the same position with every gear change?

I'm basically having the same problem as before, which is that I align the yellow mark to the millimeter in fourth gear. I shift into third, then go back to fourth, and the mark is no longer aligned. The same thing happens if I shift into second and then fourth, or if I go from first and shift up to fourth—the marks get misaligned...

Is this normal?

 

[BikeGremlin]

It's here at last! The cable cutter arrived, and I cut the housing and cable and installed everything.

Looking back at the instructions you posted here, it seems the original setting is with this SP41 cable, and what I've always had was adapted. That's a good thing!

The distance from the cap to the nut is 101 mm. The yellow mark in fourth gear was aligned pretty much perfectly; I just adjusted it a little with the shifter.

A quick question, though:

Should the yellow mark in fourth gear always be in the same position with every gear change?

I'm basically having the same problem as before, which is that I align the yellow mark to the millimeter in fourth gear. I shift into third, then go back to fourth, and the mark is no longer aligned. The same thing happens if I shift into second and then fourth, or if I go from first and shift up to fourth—the marks get misaligned...

Is this normal?

That is not normal functioning. Possible problem causes:

• The hub is not properly secured in the dropouts.
• The plastic gear shifter mount on the hub is not locked or is damaged.
• Cable is pinched in the housing, or there is some excess friction in the housing.
• Shifter is not working properly (or the cable is not sitting properly in the shifter).
• Hub internals are worn or damaged (even if not clearly enough to see).

 

[blackpanther]

Perfect!

The shifter, cable, housing, and plastic mount are all new and were just installed. They seem to be in perfect working order and mounted correctly.

I also think the hub is properly secured in the dropouts. Is there a specific way to secure it? In any case, it's solid in the dropouts and doesn't have any strange play or anything.

I really hope it's not the hub internals that are damaged...

I read somewhere that the cassette joint shouldn't be greased because it can affect the shifting accuracy. The one I bought came all greased up, and that's how I installed it. Could that be a problem?

 

[BikeGremlin]

Perfect!

The shifter, cable, housing, and plastic mount are all new and were just installed. They seem to be in perfect working order and mounted correctly.

I also think the hub is properly secured in the dropouts. Is there a specific way to secure it? In any case, it's solid in the dropouts and doesn't have any strange play or anything.

I really hope it's not the hub internals that are damaged...

I read somewhere that the cassette joint shouldn't be greased because it can affect the shifting accuracy. The one I bought came all greased up, and that's how I installed it. Could that be a problem?

Cassette has those anti-rotation washers that slide in the dropoputs. Still, if the cassette is tightened, I would expect shifting to work on the work-stand even if those washers aren't sitting inside the dropout slits (the problems should occur only when you start pedalling - applying higher torque).

Regarding the grease - I would expect it to be fine from the factory, but you could try removing some of it and see if that changes things.

A couple of days ago Mićko discussed having a customer's hub that just wouldn't shift properly with all cleaned and set up as it should. When he took the internals from his own hub and installed it into the shell of the customer's hub, it all worked fine. But he could not figure out the problem cause - the customer's hub internals looked all good, all cleaned and lubed properly. I suppose in this case too it was some wear that was too small to see with the naked eye, but still affecting the function.

 

[blackpanther]

I disassembled the cassette joint again, cleaned everything up, and reassembled it.
Not sure if it was from the disassembly or the cleaning, but the marks are now perfectly aligned. I took it for a test ride, and it SEEMS like the shifting is good and every gear (especially fourth and fifth, which were messed up after the mechanic's work) stays engaged. I'm not getting my hopes up just yet. I'll finish tightening everything up later and take it for a long test ride, then I'll let you know.

But after I trimmed the excess cable (following the instructions, so I left a good 2 cm of cable), the end frayed, nooo! If I just leave it like that, what's gonna happen? I don't wanna buy a new cable again.

 

[BikeGremlin]

I disassembled the cassette joint again, cleaned everything up, and reassembled it.
Not sure if it was from the disassembly or the cleaning, but the marks are now perfectly aligned. I took it for a test ride, and it SEEMS like the shifting is good and every gear (especially fourth and fifth, which were messed up after the mechanic's work) stays engaged. I'm not getting my hopes up just yet. I'll finish tightening everything up later and take it for a long test ride, then I'll let you know.

But after I trimmed the excess cable (following the instructions, so I left a good 2 cm of cable), the end frayed, nooo! If I just leave it like that, what's gonna happen? I don't wanna buy a new cable again.

You should be able to carefully re-wind the cable strands together and put a cable end cap on to prevent them from unwinding again. That is best done before the barrel part is tightened, but you should be able to get it done afterwards too.

Strands going freely can puncture skin easily, it hurts a bit and is annoying. Best to put a cable end cap.