Sensah Empire (Sram Red) 11 speed - Compatibility with Shimano rear derailleur?

[dijabolus]

Hello,
I have Sram Empire 11 speed road brifters with Sensah Empire rear derailleur which shifts ok except when going to 10th and 11th cog on the rear. The rear derailleur is exact copy of Sram Red, Force and Rival derailleurs (I believe they call it Exact Actuation).

I know that Sensah offers Team Pro shifters which are compatible with Shimano 105 R7000 and Ultegra R8000 road rear derailleurs, but I was wondering if Sensah Empire 11 speed (or Sram Red) shifters are compatible with Shimano MTB rear derailleurs, because I saw somewhere on this Bike gremlin blog that Sram Red road brifters could be compatible with Shimano 11 speed MTB rear derailleur.

Thanks!

 

[BikeGremlin]

Hello,
I have Sram Empire 11 speed road brifters with Sensah Empire rear derailleur which shifts ok except when going to 10th and 11th cog on the rear. The rear derailleur is exact copy of Sram Red, Force and Rival derailleurs (I believe they call it Exact Actuation).

I know that Sensah offers Team Pro shifters which are compatible with Shimano 105 R7000 and Ultegra R8000 road rear derailleurs, but I was wondering if Sensah Empire 11 speed (or Sram Red) shifters are compatible with Shimano MTB rear derailleurs, because I saw somewhere on this Bike gremlin blog that Sram Red road brifters could be compatible with Shimano 11 speed MTB rear derailleur.

Thanks!

Hi and welcome,

That is a great question that deals with the very core of the compatibility nuances. Let us dive in.

Technically, BikeGremlin is more of a knowledge base / general website than a blog, but I digress.

The info you are referring to is probably this:
https://bike.bikegremlin.com/1278/bicycle-rear-derailleur-compatibility/#2

So, in theory, old SRAM 1.1 rear derailleurs should be compatible with Shimano 11-speed MTB shifters (on 11-speed MTB cassettes). I have not yet put this to the test (no customer was "brave" enough to use an old SRAM RD with their fancy new Shimano 11-speed shifters ). Also, since the 11-speed stuff is tightly packed (sprockets very close to each other) and has low margins of error, I would not be surprised to see this combination not working perfectly in practice.

Note, this is discussing the compatibility of the RD with a shifter (i.e. can you swapt the original Shimano 11-speed MTB RD for that SRAM model).

Shifters themselves are a bit different, because they are a bit "smarter." RDs only need to wory about the movement ratio. Shifters need to account for the number of speeds, plus the RD's movement ratio. So, it's not the same. There is one more thing that needs to be just right when considering a shifter swap (shifter compatibility).

So, a SRAM 1:1 shifter could, in theory, work with a Shimano 11-speed MTB RD, but SRAM 1:1 shifters were only made for 7 to 9 speeds (so you'd need a 7, 8 or a 9-speed cassette, depending on which SRAM 1:1 shifter you sourced).

The difference is subtle, but crucial - I am not sure how well I've explained it.

Article about shifter compatibility:
https://bike.bikegremlin.com/1339/bicycle-rear-shifter-compatibility/#a

Relja

 

[dijabolus]

I conducted some experiments and concluded that bad shifting was due to road type 11 speed cassette (provided by Sensah) which has slightly bigger gap between the cogs and is slightly wider overall. I used SLX CS-M7000 11-42 cassette and managed to get perfect shifting up to 32T cog by turning in the lower limit adjust screw.

Now I am wondering if I could get the 10 speed MTB cassette (11-36) to work with this setup.

Silvestar